2078 Season Thread... 2 Rings for the Wings

[The_Niddler]

we have Tim Hortons up here. iunno how prevalent it is in the US but an Everything bagel with cream cheese toasted add bacon is a must.

We didn't have any when I lived up in Cleveland, but I am 3 hours south of there now and I have one 2 minutes from my work.

[shel311]

But the first guy Dick Todd, Ive never seen anyone jump that high that fast, ever

Couple of things on that for perspective with the latter being a more important point, check the same ratings boosts that Zheng-Xin Wu got. His was by far and away much greater, and he didn't go to any commish, so there was a precedence for that in this league, as weird as it is. Wu toiled around in the minors, a complete unknown, was even cut by a team. And one day, basically a sim happens, and he's the highest rated hitter we've ever seen, and hits over .400 his 1st 2 seasons in the league. He didn't qualify with not enough games but he started 98, still a lot, and finished with what have been the 4th higest over OPS, and the highest ever non Marino OPS in his rookie year. And this is, again, 1 season after being a completely nobody. Or actually 2 seasons, as he had a short, injury filled rookie season I believe. But you get the point.


Second, looking quickly at Todd. you mentioned the jump being that fast. It's important to note these are OSA ratings, which run once per year. So the increase you see in that 1st year he went over to Boston is in January, it's his 1st ratings update since the previous January. He was traded in December, right before the ratings boost. What I mean by that is, without seeing what the actual scouts' ratings were, there isn't much indication you can take from his quick jump.

I remember that trade, and Todd was talked about as a stud before and around the time of the trade, which basically means all of our scouts had already seen the huge ratings jump, so we all had access to that info. He gets traded in December, OSA catches up 1 month later to what all 30 Owners' scouts already knew, that he had a big ratings boost. So I do think it's important for those who weren't around to know that he wasn't just an ok player traded in December who then 1 month/1 sim later looked elite. That's not how it happened.

[TheGobOne]

I gotta say after looking at that spreadsheet it’s pretty damning tbh. Maybe I was that blind...

The most telling thing is it’s always the contact that goes up almost always ONLY the contact. That’s abnormal 100%.

If we played for money and/or Corey was still commish I’d be concerned. But since we play for fun and boomer pride I gotta get over it.

The league is in the best spot it’s ever been since I’ve been here. Honestly feels like almost every team is trying and it makes that much more FUN to win.

Don’t let 30 season old drama muddy the waters IMO.

[jeheinz72]

I see where Neurotic is coming from. Its the same principle as the Trashstros and their bull shit championship. All fans want is for them to admit wrong doing, not to enhance punishment, but just for the principle. If you get caught cheating, you get caught. If Houston suddenly admitted to their wrong doings throughout multiple season's, will anything change? Of course not. Will Dodger, Yankee, and all AL West fans continue to call them cheaters til the day they die, absofuckinglutely (Credit to whoever it was that said this prior). Its just part of the stigma. You get caught cheating, youre gonna get shit talked, til the end of time. As one of my elementary teachers once said, "dont do the crime, if you dont wanna do the time. Eventually...maybe ....10 OOTP versions into the future, it might be forgotten about...or it could be our leagues version of the black sox. Telling each other they are stupid or petty isnt really going to change the way they feel. Hell im sure there are 49er and packers fans out there that call the cowboys cheaters yanno cuz of Michael Irvins problem with the white powder. Its just part of the territory. I for one though have enjoyed this, and after a brief moment of contemplation, I think imma bring up 1 HOFer every week...until 2085. That should add a little excitement. Lastly, dude that evidence is pretty concrete, if the documentation is true....IDK Im not gonna go back and attempt to fact check it. But the first guy Dick Todd, Ive never seen anyone jump that high that fast, ever...and Ive been playing ootp since 2003, unless I was playing in commish mode and altered the guys myself.(fuck off i cheated vs the computer, offline, bite me). The thing that sticks out most is how far over his original potential that he got, and then sustained it. I got Vladimir Guerrero (Potentially ootp 21s best rated player) already regressing in one league and hes fucking 23. Even though I have my own suspicions about that commish cheating too. Now, because I opened my mouth....go ahead and shit all over me. It comes with the territory.

PS: 13 POSTS AWAY FROM THE BIG 1-0-0!

Agree with the Astros parallel 100%

And I think you should post a HOFer a week, starting with the 10 in Mike's link and let's do a deep dive into some of those dev trends!

PS - I'd chide you for cheating the CPU offline, but Shel says we can't do that anymore and I don't want to break the rulez!

[jeheinz72]

The most telling thing is it’s always the contact that goes up almost always ONLY the contact. That’s abnormal 100%.

Ding ding ding, we have a winner!

[Neurotic]

First off, I am allowed to disagree with anything you say. It is my right.
Second, I am not a cream cheese fan. Peanut butter for the win!

Just when I think we're making progress you remind me why we're not friends.

[Neurotic]

I gotta say after looking at that spreadsheet it’s pretty damning tbh. Maybe I was that blind...

The most telling thing is it’s always the contact that goes up almost always ONLY the contact. That’s abnormal 100%.

If we played for money and/or Corey was still commish I’d be concerned. But since we play for fun and boomer pride I gotta get over it.

The league is in the best spot it’s ever been since I’ve been here. Honestly feels like almost every team is trying and it makes that much more FUN to win.

Don’t let 30 season old drama muddy the waters IMO.

To be clear, my intention was never to "muddy the waters" with the intent to get Corey removed. I would never ask that in sincerity (I realize I said that he should do us a favor and leave earlier in the thread, that was a comment made in jest). My intentions are clearly just to poke at something I find.. not offensive.. I guess disrespectful would be the closest definition? I certainly did not expect that comment to result in what has unfolded.

[jeheinz72]

I remember that trade, and Todd was talked about as a stud before and around the time of the trade, which basically means all of our scouts had already seen the huge ratings jump, so we all had access to that info. He gets traded in December, OSA catches up 1 month later to what all 30 Owners' scouts already knew, that he had a big ratings boost. So I do think it's important for those who weren't around to know that he wasn't just an ok player traded in December who then 1 month/1 sim later looked elite. That's not how it happened.

It's worth nothing that then after the 1st OSA update post-trade, he still went on to get +20/18/20 in the big 3.

Which is the big tell-tale. Here are the gains from the first OSA *after* acquired - so changes that solely happened in-house in Boston

18/22/7 for Munoz
22/6/13 for Payne
38/24/40 for De Los Santos
24/0/18 for Bryan
16/11/20 for Martinez
15/0/23 for Kirk

[shel311]

Here are the gains from the first OSA *after* acquired - so changes that solely happened in-house in Boston

I'd question the changes solely happened after acquisition, you don't know that since all we have is OSA.

As I mentioned, I'm very confident that Todd's ratings occurred well before January post acquisition as he was a talked about dude around that time of the trade, and I don't see why he'd have been on the radar of the league unless our scouts had already seen the ratings jump.


Again, just providing context here that we're using the once per year OSA, which doesn't mean the jump actually happened post acquisition, especially if a couple of these dudes were traded in the offseason.

Just looked at those dudes plus Todd, 7 guys. 4 of the 7 were traded in November or December and a 5th guy in August. So my question I'd pose would be, how do you know the ratings increase took place post acquisition and our scouts didn't have the bulk of these guys' ratings boosts accounted for at the time of the trade?

[The_Niddler]

First off, I am allowed to disagree with anything you say. It is my right.
Second, I am not a cream cheese fan. Peanut butter for the win!

Just when I think we're making progress you remind me why we're not friends.

[jeheinz72]

Here are the gains from the first OSA *after* acquired - so changes that solely happened in-house in Boston

I'd question the changes solely happened after acquisition, you don't know that since all we have is OSA.

As I mentioned, I'm very confident that Todd's ratings occurred well before January post acquisition as he was a talked about dude around that time of the trade, and I don't see why he'd have been on the radar of the league unless our scouts had already seen the ratings jump.


Again, just providing context here that we're using the once per year OSA, which doesn't mean the jump actually happened post acquisition, especially if a couple of these dudes were traded in the offseason.

Just looked at those dudes plus Todd, 7 guys. 4 of the 7 were traded in November or December and a 5th guy in August. So my question I'd pose would be, how do you know the ratings increase took place post acquisition and our scouts didn't have the bulk of these guys' ratings boosts accounted for at the time of the trade?

Yeah, maybe you didn't get what I was saying, those differences are what they gained AFTER the 1st OSA when Boston had them. So if they were dealt in December, OSA scouted 1/1 - then from that 1st Boston OSA scout, they gained what I outlined above (in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc time they were OSA-scouted in Boston). So I've already cooked in that maybe they were potentially at that 1st OSA scouting at the moment they were acquired.

[ajalves]

Just FYI, for anyone that needs "hard proof", this is about as close as it comes:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

This is 10 different players all from the 2049 Boston roster. All of them show progression of their potentials within the first year or two of being acquired by Boston. They all seemingly develop to their potentials in the 2049 and 2050 window. While its been mentioned before that this is statistically possible (to be fair, its statistically possible we're all living in the Matrix right now), its VERY improbable to have happened genuinely. This type of progression in this sheer number (keep in mind this is just players off ONE years team) just doesn't happen in OOTP. Let alone for them all to develop, and not just develop, but develop in the same window.

The reference to his success earlier was an easier attempt to show you just the level of absurdity in which the editing was happening.

just from an outsiders perspective.....thats how everyones players would progress back in the day if I recall. I have mentioned the fact that we have maybe 5-10 overall 80/80 players in the league now when in the past (just a guess) we probably had 50 of them

i mentioned in the past if you had a top 5 pick you were pretty much guaranteed a future 75/80 guy... now we go multiple drafts without them

i truly feel like 80/80 guys were quite abundant back in the day and, to Dave's point, Corey was able to trade a decent amount of them to go with guys he drafted. back then guys would trade an 80 pot guys cause you could get two 75 pot guys for him. nowadays anyone over 70 pot is like gold

not sure if that means anything

[ajalves]

The passive aggressiveness in this league runs deep. Hell, it even ran off, arguably, one of the best owners to ever grace the league....and he knew nothing about baseball. And I mean NOTHING!

a self admitted 'cheater'...

[KShorey]

I can guarantee one thing, a scout had NOTHING to do with that sort of success. I was naive in my first NDL stint and thought a scout made all the difference...ended up paying a Legendary across the board scout 6 mil per season, didn't make much difference. He still missed on about 80% of his 80 potential prospects

[nick]

i use my scout for everything and im a good owner.

[DParm]

I can guarantee one thing, a scout had NOTHING to do with that sort of success. I was naive in my first NDL stint and thought a scout made all the difference...ended up paying a Legendary across the board scout 6 mil per season, didn't make much difference. He still missed on about 80% of his 80 potential prospects

Thats where the "Neutral, favors ability, and favors tools" comes into play.

[DParm]

You need to cheat vs the computer. Haha had the take a old NL west shot.

Hey my dickheaded friend it was more like I was creating myself to be the GOAT, not altering an entire team. Just ME!

[KShorey]

i use my scout for everything and im a good owner.

You've always fielded good teams, but also missed on some guys.

[nick]

some say im tough like gorilla glue

[GeorgesGoons]

The passive aggressiveness in this league runs deep. Hell, it even ran off, arguably, one of the best owners to ever grace the league....and he knew nothing about baseball. And I mean NOTHING!

a self admitted 'cheater'...

Was it cheating or exploiting? Honest question. Everything he did with that exploitation was something we all could do. If it was the searching for IFA's that weren't signed right away by teams. I'm not sure if this is what you were talking about, or if it was before my time.

I know for a fact that Ted could not have altered any ratings as he had zero access to them. To me that is blatant cheating, exploiting a flaw is not cheating. A little shady, yes, but not cheating. And that was right around (or before) I joined in 2021. He showed he was an exceptional owner and didn't need to cheat to win for the next 50 or so seasons. Can't say that for what we have been discussing over the last 12 or so pages. The record proves it, a .500(ish) owner goes on an unreal run as commish. Then becomes a .500(ish) owner again once he relinquishes the commish role.