And you look at teams defensive efficiency in this game compared to real life and it doesn't compare. I believe Nick pointed it out a couple of seasons ago, the top team would have been near the bottom in real life. I don't care about defense in this game, it doesn't save runs to the point where you are adding 10 games to your win column. In this game, if you are only good offensively (top 25 in only 3 categories) then you don't belong in my opinion. Maybe next year I'll have a change of heart, but I don't think so. His WAR is inflated due to his SB's and defense. Just my opinionshel311 wrote:George on Ozzie Smith in the MLB thread a few months ago:GeorgesGoons wrote:Don't think it compares as much as you are making it out to be. Crow was never one of the most dominant players in his era. Especially if defensive numbers play into your WAR (not sure if it does or not). His best season in 2020 none of those numbers say elite (except his .343 batting average). He has a career 115 OPS+, meh!That is the reason I didn't vote him in, and I wont next year either. Just my opinion on him.
GeorgesGoons wrote:Ozzie is a HOF'er because of his defensive wizardry alone.
2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
Lewis has a lot of the career records for stuff because he played every game in the position, but he did so at a very good level.ajalves wrote:I don't have the game up...wouldn't mind further explanationReignOnU wrote:Defensively, Crow is the 2nd best and arguably best CF (tip of the cap to Spawn Lewis) our league has ever had. He posted the single highest season ZR ever and 3 of the top ever. I give Lewis a lot of credit though, because his longevity at being good is remarkable.
During a period of about 4-5 years, while Crow was my main CF, he played at the absolute peak that we've ever had. But like I do with most of players, I shifted him to other positions to get other players involved and eventually traded him away. Not sure what he did at that point.
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
I believe the concept is that you take where the fielder is standing as the ball is hit, and make an actual circular zone around him that the average player at that position would make on that play. Then you determine how many plays that player makes in that zone as well as outside of that zone to determine how good he is at making plays compared to everyone else. Then there's a way to extrapolate that out to determine how many runs he's saved compared to the average player, kinda like WAR, but just an actual runs saved figure.ajalves wrote:I don't have the game up...wouldn't mind further explanationReignOnU wrote:Defensively, Crow is the 2nd best and arguably best CF (tip of the cap to Spawn Lewis) our league has ever had. He posted the single highest season ZR ever and 3 of the top ever. I give Lewis a lot of credit though, because his longevity at being good is remarkable.
That being said, no one has ever done it as good as Crow at his peak at CF in our league.
Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
whats the specific number?shel311 wrote:
That being said, no one has ever done it as good as Crow at his peak at CF in our league.
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
I don't have the game up so I don't know Crow's zone ratings off hand.ajalves wrote:whats the specific number?shel311 wrote:
That being said, no one has ever done it as good as Crow at his peak at CF in our league.
You may be getting at this and I thought about it after I posted it, I don't know how AA stacks up to Crow in regards to zone rating, but I think that Crow did it better a bit more consistently for some sustained amount of time.
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
shel311 wrote:I don't have the game up so I don't know Crow's zone ratings off hand.ajalves wrote:whats the specific number?shel311 wrote:
That being said, no one has ever done it as good as Crow at his peak at CF in our league.
You may be getting at this and I thought about it after I posted it, I don't know how AA stacks up to Crow in regards to zone rating, but I think that Crow did it better a bit more consistently for some sustained amount of time.
AA is likely going to be in that conversation with Lewis. Not sure the 5yr peak can be hit... but maybe. He's close for sure.
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
austin anderson is already better than crow wtf.
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
Defensively?nick wrote:austin anderson is already better than crow wtf.
Anyone have and can post Crow's defensive numbers at CF?
Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
I'm sure he did. I just was curious
Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
oh christ we're voting people into the HOF on defense now?
Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
in 795 games as CF, AA is .996 pct, 2.16 RF, +129.9 ZR, 1.119 Eff
Crow LF - 397g - .987, 1.67RF, +17.8ZR and 1.058eff
CF - 1236G - .997, 2.42RF, +207.5ZR and 1.107 eff
RF - 162 / 3990 - 2.08 - +11.2 - 1.057
if ZR is the end all be all then per game, AA is 0.16339 ZR/Game and MC was 0.16788 ZR/Game so pretty crazy how close lol.
Crow LF - 397g - .987, 1.67RF, +17.8ZR and 1.058eff
CF - 1236G - .997, 2.42RF, +207.5ZR and 1.107 eff
RF - 162 / 3990 - 2.08 - +11.2 - 1.057
if ZR is the end all be all then per game, AA is 0.16339 ZR/Game and MC was 0.16788 ZR/Game so pretty crazy how close lol.
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
In OOTP it doesn't matter. Defense does not matter one bit. It's all hitting and pitching. How many games in the playoffs were lost due to an error? We can field a team full of Bill Buckners and it not matternick wrote:oh christ we're voting people into the HOF on defense now?
Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
hmmph, looking around I saw Anderson had a similarity score of 961 with Tim Blake of Winterfell. That is extremely high. Almost unheard of. I never even knew Blake was this good, saw the name up there a couple times, just didn't realize.
Anderson is on the right. Both 28.
Anderson is on the right. Both 28.
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
How do you know it doesn't matter at all, much less being comparable to in real life?GeorgesGoons wrote:In OOTP it doesn't matter. Defense does not matter one bit. It's all hitting and pitching. How many games in the playoffs were lost due to an error? We can field a team full of Bill Buckners and it not matternick wrote:oh christ we're voting people into the HOF on defense now?
Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
i used to look it up and like half the NDLB would be dead last in the MLB in defensive related metrics. I dont know about now but go do the research
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
100% false.GeorgesGoons wrote:In OOTP it doesn't matter. Defense does not matter one bit. It's all hitting and pitching. How many games in the playoffs were lost due to an error? We can field a team full of Bill Buckners and it not matternick wrote:oh christ we're voting people into the HOF on defense now?
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
Uhh George if the pitcher doesn't strike out every single batter, someone has to field the ball right? Defense is huge especially for teams that are ground ball dependent. Sure you can win a championship with less than stellar defense but it just puts more pressure on the offense and we all know that can come and go in the postseasonReignOnU wrote:100% false.GeorgesGoons wrote:In OOTP it doesn't matter. Defense does not matter one bit. It's all hitting and pitching. How many games in the playoffs were lost due to an error? We can field a team full of Bill Buckners and it not matternick wrote:oh christ we're voting people into the HOF on defense now?
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
I have not cared about defense at all since I have been in the league. Won a championship and when I wasn't rebuilding at the top of my division and making the playoffs. Defense is so minute in this game it is ridiculous. As long as you aren't putting a catcher in centerfield or vice versa you'll be fine. Like nick said, look up the defensive numbers for a team in OOTP and compare them to real life. We would get laughed at in a real stadium the way our teams play as a collective wholeDRWebs wrote:Uhh George if the pitcher doesn't strike out every single batter, someone has to field the ball right? Defense is huge especially for teams that are ground ball dependent. Sure you can win a championship with less than stellar defense but it just puts more pressure on the offense and we all know that can come and go in the postseasonReignOnU wrote:100% false.GeorgesGoons wrote:In OOTP it doesn't matter. Defense does not matter one bit. It's all hitting and pitching. How many games in the playoffs were lost due to an error? We can field a team full of Bill Buckners and it not matternick wrote:oh christ we're voting people into the HOF on defense now?
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Re: 2039 Hall of Fame Voting Results
Just because our ratings are worse than MLB doesn't make it irrelevant.
It's all relative to our league, it matters. Doesn't mean you can't overcome it, but it matters.
It's all relative to our league, it matters. Doesn't mean you can't overcome it, but it matters.