NDL Forum

DRWebs wrote:Granted I'm not a NBA junkie but still hearing a ton about Kevin Love being useless and they're better off without him... Aren't they pretty much putting him in a position to fail by having him just sit in the corner every (or seemingly every) offensive possession?

the most misunderstood thing in basketball by mainstream fans is usage.

there is one ball so having 3 ball dominant 'stars' isn't typically the best way to go. there are guys out there who will be best used as a ball dominant player (think super efficient stars), some guys are better as #2 usage guys (think very talented players who are lower efficiency), some guys are better as a 3rd usage (think a guy like Draymond who is well rounded offensively and defensively, can do things without the ball in his hands) 4th usage type guys are typically best when they are elite 1 category guys (think an unreal 3 pt shooter or a great rebounder, a lock down defender, etc) 5th usage and beyond typically are best when they are high energy competent defenders who have a skill that compliments the top 2 usage guys.

this is a simplistic/basic guide, but having 3 guys who are great scorers who use the ball all the time are essentially lowering the value of each of them or of the ones who make the usage sacrifice. a guy like Bosh got the same criticism. but the best use in these situations for a guy like Love and Bosh around a player like Lebron is to create space and pull out a big guy from the paint so he can get to the basket with less interference (spacing is the most important thing coaches needs to figure out ways to create in the NBA which is why stretch 4's are so popular now). putting the ball in Love's hands so he gets his 20&10 essentially means you take it out of Lebron's hands 15-20% of the time. That's not typically the smart play nor would an alpha like Lebron accept that. Cleveland probably gets the same production from a guy like Channing Frye 60% of the time that they'll get from Love. The advantage of having an option like Love however is that if something ever happens to Kyrie or Lebron or they are having a cold game, they can put the ball in his hands more and he gives them a 1/2 usage option. Vast majority of teams don't have that so if they lose a top 2 guy they are completely fucked. However, as we saw in game 3, Cleveland doesn't lose a ton with Love off court.

I'd use Love off the bench if i had the job so he could play less with just 1 of the Kyrie/Lebron duo and allow him to use his best talents more often. playing Kyrie with Love to me is pointless since they both are sub par defenders. The real way Love could be used better is if someone convinced him to just rebound. Sort of like a Tristan role, but like you said, he's being used to draw defenders from the paint so that's hard.

i've been calling for a Love to Boston trade for over a year. his deficiencies defensively would be hidden there more and he could be a 1a offensive threat with Thomas and go back to putting up 20+ and 10 boards.

Cnasty wrote:

Cnasty wrote:Delaying the inevitable.

NBA has to make sure it gets to at least 6 games so 2-2 is imminent for some manufactured drama!!

Setting up for your normal Cleveland type nightmare after getting it to game 7 and the NBA's plan worked perfectly.

Warriors by 10+ in the final chapter.

DRiccio21 wrote:

DRWebs wrote:Granted I'm not a NBA junkie but still hearing a ton about Kevin Love being useless and they're better off without him... Aren't they pretty much putting him in a position to fail by having him just sit in the corner every (or seemingly every) offensive possession?

the most misunderstood thing in basketball by mainstream fans is usage.

there is one ball so having 3 ball dominant 'stars' isn't typically the best way to go. there are guys out there who will be best used as a ball dominant player (think super efficient stars), some guys are better as #2 usage guys (think very talented players who are lower efficiency), some guys are better as a 3rd usage (think a guy like Draymond who is well rounded offensively and defensively, can do things without the ball in his hands) 4th usage type guys are typically best when they are elite 1 category guys (think an unreal 3 pt shooter or a great rebounder, a lock down defender, etc) 5th usage and beyond typically are best when they are high energy competent defenders who have a skill that compliments the top 2 usage guys.

this is a simplistic/basic guide, but having 3 guys who are great scorers who use the ball all the time are essentially lowering the value of each of them or of the ones who make the usage sacrifice. a guy like Bosh got the same criticism. but the best use in these situations for a guy like Love and Bosh around a player like Lebron is to create space and pull out a big guy from the paint so he can get to the basket with less interference (spacing is the most important thing coaches needs to figure out ways to create in the NBA which is why stretch 4's are so popular now). putting the ball in Love's hands so he gets his 20&10 essentially means you take it out of Lebron's hands 15-20% of the time. That's not typically the smart play nor would an alpha like Lebron accept that. Cleveland probably gets the same production from a guy like Channing Frye 60% of the time that they'll get from Love. The advantage of having an option like Love however is that if something ever happens to Kyrie or Lebron or they are having a cold game, they can put the ball in his hands more and he gives them a 1/2 usage option. Vast majority of teams don't have that so if they lose a top 2 guy they are completely fucked. However, as we saw in game 3, Cleveland doesn't lose a ton with Love off court.

I'd use Love off the bench if i had the job so he could play less with just 1 of the Kyrie/Lebron duo and allow him to use his best talents more often. playing Kyrie with Love to me is pointless since they both are sub par defenders. The real way Love could be used better is if someone convinced him to just rebound. Sort of like a Tristan role, but like you said, he's being used to draw defenders from the paint so that's hard.

i've been calling for a Love to Boston trade for over a year. his deficiencies defensively would be hidden there more and he could be a 1a offensive threat with Thomas and go back to putting up 20+ and 10 boards.

Would Brad Stevens want a player with D problems tho?

@mikekaplan_: In 2012 Amir Johnson was suspended 1 game for throwing his mouthpiece

I know I know, no chance.

shel311 wrote:

@mikekaplan_: In 2012 Amir Johnson was suspended 1 game for throwing his mouthpiece

I know I know, no chance.

No chance. Less than no chance.

The 6th foul was a bad call. But you can't throw a hissy fit.

Klay walking out before it was over would have blown up if it had been Lebron.

Gonna be a crazy finale

I'd almost say this is a slam dunk suspension for any game Steph played this season...except for game 7.

Meaning, if he did that in game 5, I'm fairly confident he's got a better than 50% chance of being suspended for game 6.

Yea. Or for anyone else not named Lebron or Steph.

Even as a Cavs fan I wouldn't want that though. If you're gonna win, you're gonna win against a full team and earn it.

Lebron last 2 games:

32/57 (56.1%) (50%3pt) FGs

82 Points
24 Rebs
18 Assits
7 Steals
6 Blocks
3 Turnovers

shel311 wrote:Lebron last 2 games:

32/57 (56.1%) (50%3pt) FGs

82 Points
24 Rebs
18 Assits
7 Steals
6 Blocks
3 Turnovers

You missed:

250 times trash talking/taunting after the whistle
43 times acting like the world is ending because he didn't get a foul call on a play
4 personal fouls/times acting like the world is ending because he got a foul called against him despite being more physical than anyone else on the floor

When did basketball become some bizarre amalgamation of post-whistle football and over-acting soccer?

Dak Killington

dakshdar wrote:

shel311 wrote:Lebron last 2 games:

32/57 (56.1%) (50%3pt) FGs

82 Points
24 Rebs
18 Assits
7 Steals
6 Blocks
3 Turnovers

You missed:

250 times trash talking/taunting after the whistle
43 times acting like the world is ending because he didn't get a foul call on a play
4 personal fouls/times acting like the world is ending because he got a foul called against him despite being more physical than anyone else on the floor

When did basketball become some bizarre amalgamation of post-whistle football and over-acting soccer?

How do you get to just elbow the fuck out of people all the time and never get called for it?

dakshdar wrote:

shel311 wrote:Lebron last 2 games:

32/57 (56.1%) (50%3pt) FGs

82 Points
24 Rebs
18 Assits
7 Steals
6 Blocks
3 Turnovers

You missed:

250 times trash talking/taunting after the whistle
43 times acting like the world is ending because he didn't get a foul call on a play
4 personal fouls/times acting like the world is ending because he got a foul called against him despite being more physical than anyone else on the floor

When did basketball become some bizarre amalgamation of post-whistle football and over-acting soccer?

That gif...

That was even before the dagger was jammed into their hearts!

nick wrote: Would Brad Stevens want a player with D problems tho?

you can (somewhat) hide a bad defender on a really good overall defensive team. at least to the point where the value of his offense could out weigh his poor defense and he can be a really valuable piece to the team. In other situations where his offense isn't utilized properly, the defensive vulnerability can outweigh the offensive ability. i think Stevens would welcome him with open arms, assuming their desire for a big time scorer is as high as its made out to be in the public.

Lebron leads all players in the series in:

Points
Rebounds
Assists
Blocks
Steals


Not bad.

Curry and Kerr both get the customary 25k fine

Ayesha Curry is quickly becoming as distracting as Lebron's mom.

Gotta be fake, right?