NDL Forum

DRiccio21 wrote:i'm also trying not to jump to conclusions either way.

the media did a great job painting Incognito out to be a complete sociopathic human terrorist but I have a hard time with the 'other teammates are neandrathals' line. maybe some, but not as many as have come out to support Incognito. at some point when people that close to the situation speak you at least have to step back from your stance. I was fully for Martin before, now i'm more towards the Incognito is probably a prick but Martin probably has some issues that led to this camp.

I think your right Martin has some issues he needs to deal with also, but the NFL culture is classless.

As a teacher who sees "bullying" every day I think the bullying issue has gotten way, way out of hand in our country. Do you know that the school, by state law, is now responsible for dealing with issues of "bullying" that don't even occur during school hours or on school days? Parents can now call the school and say that little Sally was sending mean twitter messages to little Janie Saturday night and that we need to do something about it and we are legally obligated to do so. If I hear someone in my class say that someone was "bullying" them on Facebook Sunday afternoon, I am legally obligated to report it. The schools are now doing more parenting than ever.

This is only marginally related to the Martin/Incognito thing but these are two grown men. It may be politically incorrect and insensitive, but Martin needed to handle this himself. Running to the media for whatever reason, bullied or not, only made his problem worse.

Doley, I don't disagree about it being potentially harmful atmosphere in the NFL.

but at some point we have to make a decision, we either live in a bubble with every atmosphere controlled to create a fear free world or we live with the idea that not all things are created equal.

now all people should be given the same opportunity to succeed without a fear for their health or safety, but the fact they are ball busters or maybe worse doesn't bother me. he has outlets in place if it got too bad. now if those outlets were nothing more than a façade and he couldn't use it then that's an issue.

Dolemitesooner wrote:

shel311 wrote:

Dolemitesooner wrote:I'll answer your dumb ass question

Give me dumb logic, you'll get dumb questions.

Dolemitesooner wrote:The line is Killing people, stealing from people, and physical harming people is not excused.

So, if you do a whole bunch of drugs under the guise of trying to fit in with a group, you're innocent according to Dole and everyone else is at fault, right?

Never said that..

I said it, based on the line that YOU drew.

So if you don't agree with that statement, it looks like you're already shifting the line I asked you to draw, which would effectively make it not nearly as dumb of a question as you thought.

Dolemitesooner wrote:I work on a team of a little over 100 people. No one here is getting arrested. Having meeting a strip clubs or making the remarks these guys are making.

The line, it keeps moving and moving and moving...

DRiccio21 wrote: he has outlets in place if it got too bad. now if those outlets were nothing more than a façade and he couldn't use it then that's an issue.

This. I mean, I'd say we honestly don't know if the culture was any different or worse than any other locker room, that remains to be seen. Maybe we never found out.

If the stuff about Ireland is true and that Martin's agent did seek out Ireland to talk about the issue and Ireland's response was to tell the agent that maybe Martin should punch Incognito, that's obviously a pretty bad situation on the GM's part.

We really just don't know if it was way over the line out of control type stuff, or just the normal NFL locker room stuff that has been going on for decades(right or wrong), but we do know that Martin couldn't adapt to that atmosphere, and we know that he possibly tried to use his outlets and that didn't work either.

Peay, and driccio you both make salient points. I just think no one's owes Incognito an apology because he is a meathead. He pushed things too far. Bulling? Ehhhh. I am just saying the guy is a Loser that it appears was supported by the team in his endless hazing.

shel311 wrote:

Dolemitesooner wrote:Making player buy other plays Jet-ski's Big deal

What do you know about that incident?


This jet ski example is such a great example of how the media shapes and controls the publics thoughts on things.

Glad you brought that one up.

I was hoping Dole would answer what he knew about the jet ski incident but the replies started pouring in so it got lost.

Here's why it's such a great example of people just following along with the media outrage.

This jet ski "story" was based on an interview that Incognito himself did with LeBatard probably over a year ago. He volunteered the info to Lebby. Not one media person, fan, no one had a single issue with it. There was no story written about it, nothing. Then this story breaks and NOW the media and Dole is pointing to this as an example of a "big deal"??

Turrible, just turrible.

Kind of seems like Martin is a puss and went about this all wrong... crazy.

ReignOnU wrote:Kind of seems like Martin is a puss and went about this all wrong... crazy.

I don't think there was a right way to go about it. He basically had a few bad options to choose from.

shel311 wrote:

ReignOnU wrote:Kind of seems like Martin is a puss and went about this all wrong... crazy.

I don't think there was a right way to go about it. He basically had a few bad options to choose from.

Not being a puss is a start.

Dolemitesooner wrote:Peay, and driccio you both make salient points. I just think no one's owes Incognito an apology because he is a meathead. He pushed things too far. Bulling? Ehhhh. I am just saying the guy is a Loser that it appears was supported by the team in his endless hazing.

isn't calling someone a meathead bullying? good ol double standards

nick wrote:

Dolemitesooner wrote:Peay, and driccio you both make salient points. I just think no one's owes Incognito an apology because he is a meathead. He pushed things too far. Bulling? Ehhhh. I am just saying the guy is a Loser that it appears was supported by the team in his endless hazing.

isn't calling someone a meathead bullying? good ol double standards

By the definition of "bullying", no it isn't. A single or limited instances of the behavior is not bullying. But a planned, repetitive system of attacks designed to assert one's dominance over another in any form or fashion is bullying.

I remember when bullying meant repeatedly beating the shit out of someone and you solved it by fighting back. Guess I'm old and a neanderthal ... at 35.

trendon wrote:I remember when bullying meant repeatedly beating the shit out of someone and you solved it by fighting back. Guess I'm old and a neanderthal ... at 35.

Of all of the bad options Martin had to choose from, fighting Incognito was probably the worst of the bad options

trendon wrote:I remember when bullying meant repeatedly beating the shit out of someone and you solved it by fighting back. Guess I'm old and a neanderthal ... at 35.

you aren't a neanderthal, you're just a tough guy.

DRiccio21 wrote:

trendon wrote:I remember when bullying meant repeatedly beating the shit out of someone and you solved it by fighting back. Guess I'm old and a neanderthal ... at 35.

you aren't a neanderthal, you're just a tough guy.

Yep. A human male with aggression. So strange.

trendon wrote: Yep. A human male with aggression. So strange.

it's not strange at all, your need to point it out all the time and make judgments of others based on it... strange.

your comments make it seem like if a guy doesn't rage out or wishes not to fight is less of a man or less tough.