NFL Thread

Post by **ReignOnU** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:07 pm

shel311 wrote:Question still stands, give me 1 other example of guys who are considered fringe top 10 or not top 10 ever being considered elite?

How many times have we seen that before?

Maybe Nick and Jsence see it all the time, this is a first for me.

Top 20 overall players in the NFL are all elite.

Post by **shel311** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:15 pm

Not in that post you quoted, but in the original post, I specified top 10-15 at their position

Post by **The_Niddler** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:27 pm

I tend to think of it as if the guy will/should end up in the hall of fame.
That is where the elite live on after they retire from the game. There is and should not be a set number or %.

Unless you are Pete Rose in Baseball.

Post by **shel311** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:42 pm

We've gotten way far off of the original premise of mine, that Rodgers makes them look better than they actually are, which I'm not sure anyone would argue, except Jsence, as he even argued that maybe they help Rodgers more than he helps them. That, but somehow I'm the guy he complains about arguing for the sake of arguing.

It's simple logic: 1 is arguably the GOAT, obviously one of the GOAT QBs. The other 2 are good WRs. Doesn't seem controversial at all for me to insinuate Rodgers makes them look better moreso than the other way around.

cougnix · Post by **cougnix** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:48 pm

I would like to see the complete list of fines in a year for the NFL and the fine-able offenses.

Esiason wants the NFL to fine Sherman for saying Kraft and Goodell hanging out is a conflict of interest when dealing with the footballs.
Lynch possible fine for wearing his own brand hat, that ironically was a New Era hat, official hat of the NFL.

I haven't been able to find it, but I know that the NFL was selling a collectible photo of Lynch's crotch grab against Arizona. So they fine him and sell a photo of it in the same breath. I don't have proof of it, but it is definitely interesting.
Found story on it: http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... -for-sale/
It was nice to hear they actually talked about football and matchups yesterday at media day instead of football psi

cougnix · Post by **cougnix** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:51 pm

shel311 wrote:We've gotten way far off of the original premise of mine, that Rodgers makes them look better than they actually are, which I'm not sure anyone would argue, except Jsence, as he even argued that maybe they help Rodgers more than he helps them. That, but somehow I'm the guy he complains about arguing for the sake of arguing.

It's simple logic: 1 is arguably the GOAT, obviously one of the GOAT QBs. The other 2 are good WRs. Doesn't seem controversial at all for me to insinuate Rodgers makes them look better moreso than the other way around.

I agree with you shel, alot of the success of WR's most definitely start from the QB. Deion Branch was good to great in NE, but he comes to Seattle and what did he do? Goes back to NE and Brady just has that ability to make mediocre receivers look amazing. Same with Rodgers, he has the ability to just wing that football all over the yard.

Whittness10 · Post by **Whittness10** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:50 pm

I love how my comment about Wilson being elite got taken seriously. I was honestly joking when I said he had to be elite if he was top 10 at something. I must have forgotten my LOL emoticon. My bad.

cougnix · Post by **cougnix** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 3:59 pm

Whittness10 wrote:I love how my comment about Wilson being elite got taken seriously. I was honestly joking when I said he had to be elite if he was top 10 at something. I must have forgotten my LOL emoticon. My bad.

He isn't elite. He just wins by hitting the first read and running if it isn't there. He won't be elite until he fits the mold of a pocket passer, look what that did to Mike Vick, turned an electric player that found ways to win and turned him into a mediocre back up. I think the difference with Wilson is I think he has a better chance to get better as a passer than Vick did. Vick tried to force too much.

I really don't care if he ever gets to an elite status, I just want to enjoy this ride of what he is doing. He's special, that is the truth and if people think otherwise you don't pay attention. He isn't supposed to do what he is doing at 5'10", no way he is 5'11". A buddy of mine got a picture with him at an American Family Insurance function and he really isn't very tall.

Whittness10 · Post by **Whittness10** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:06 pm

cougnix wrote:
Whittness10 wrote:I love how my comment about Wilson being elite got taken seriously. I was honestly joking when I said he had to be elite if he was top 10 at something. I must have forgotten my LOL emoticon. My bad.
He isn't elite. He just wins by hitting the first read and running if it isn't there. He won't be elite until he fits the mold of a pocket passer, look what that did to Mike Vick, turned an electric player that found ways to win and turned him into a mediocre back up. I think the difference with Wilson is I think he has a better chance to get better as a passer than Vick did. Vick tried to force too much.

I really don't care if he ever gets to an elite status, I just want to enjoy this ride of what he is doing. He's special, that is the truth and if people think otherwise you don't pay attention. He isn't supposed to do what he is doing at 5'10", no way he is 5'11". A buddy of mine got a picture with him at an American Family Insurance function and he really isn't very tall.

Why did you quote me and tell me all this? I don't care if he's considered elite or not

cougnix · Post by **cougnix** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:07 pm

Whittness10 wrote:
cougnix wrote:
Whittness10 wrote:I love how my comment about Wilson being elite got taken seriously. I was honestly joking when I said he had to be elite if he was top 10 at something. I must have forgotten my LOL emoticon. My bad.
He isn't elite. He just wins by hitting the first read and running if it isn't there. He won't be elite until he fits the mold of a pocket passer, look what that did to Mike Vick, turned an electric player that found ways to win and turned him into a mediocre back up. I think the difference with Wilson is I think he has a better chance to get better as a passer than Vick did. Vick tried to force too much.

I really don't care if he ever gets to an elite status, I just want to enjoy this ride of what he is doing. He's special, that is the truth and if people think otherwise you don't pay attention. He isn't supposed to do what he is doing at 5'10", no way he is 5'11". A buddy of mine got a picture with him at an American Family Insurance function and he really isn't very tall.
Why did you quote me and tell me all this? I don't care if he's considered elite or not

I like quoting, quotings my favorite

nick · Post by **nick** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:08 pm

Wilson is the first ever true dual threat QB in the NFL and people are scared of it. Apparently you gotta throw the ball 45 times a game. Meanwhile, no QB is close to 800 rushing yards or 7 YPC running the Read option effectively in the NFL. Its ALWAYS the D. the Same D that was 7-9 and dog shit before Wilson came. Its also Lynch, the same Lynch who sucked at Buffalo, had a shit 1st yr at Seattle, then maybe (not 100% sure) 1 good yr at Seattle before Wilson, but once Wilson and the Read option come Lynchs numbers explode.

Wilsons elite.

trendon · Post by **trendon** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:20 pm

nick wrote:Wilson is the first ever true dual threat QB in the NFL and people are scared of it.

What?

cougnix · Post by **cougnix** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:20 pm

I like that you also support Wilson's efforts, but you are wrong on your assessment of the Seahawks. The 7-9 has essentially nobody that is now on the team. Safeties were Lawyer Milloy and Thomas was a rookie. The Seahawks made upwards of 300 roster transactions that year and the Oline had a rookie LT in Okung and a rookie C in Unger.

*and Lynch had 1200 yards in that season.

I'm a year off, but still, rookies and 2nd year players all over that defense sprinkled with over the hill guys like Trufant

nick · Post by **nick** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:22 pm

trendon wrote:
nick wrote:Wilson is the first ever true dual threat QB in the NFL and people are scared of it.
What?

ok probably not first, but hes the only dual threat QB in the NFL right now.

trendon · Post by **trendon** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:23 pm

nick wrote:
trendon wrote:
nick wrote:Wilson is the first ever true dual threat QB in the NFL and people are scared of it.
What?
ok probably not first, but hes the only dual threat QB in the NFL right now.

Not even close to being first but you're probably right about him being the only one extremely competent at both right now.

Post by **shel311** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:25 pm

nick wrote:Wilson is the first ever true dual threat QB in the NFL and people are scared of it.

What?

Oh, and you're really trying to say the D of the past 2 seasons which can be talked about in the same breath as some of the all time defensive units is as good as they were before Wilson got there? You don't think that.

Post by **shel311** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:26 pm

trendon wrote:
nick wrote:Wilson is the first ever true dual threat QB in the NFL and people are scared of it.
What?

Holy crap, same exact answer. Well done!!!

nick · Post by **nick** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:27 pm

whats funny is, I used to hate on Brady for what people hate on Wilson for, that hes a "system QB". but what will happen with Wilson, like Brady, is people will just start calling him elite and soon itll be acceptable. Elite is elite, theres no number on elite, its superior to those around you.

nick · Post by **nick** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:27 pm

shel311 wrote:
trendon wrote:
nick wrote:Wilson is the first ever true dual threat QB in the NFL and people are scared of it.
What?
Holy crap, same exact answer. Well done!!!

we moved on. i admitted to making a mistake. hes the only one now.

Post by **shel311** » Wed Jan 28, 2015 4:42 pm

nick wrote:whats funny is, I used to hate on Brady for what people hate on Wilson for, that hes a "system QB". but what will happen with Wilson, like Brady, is people will just start calling him elite and soon itll be acceptable. Elite is elite, theres no number on elite, its superior to those around you.

It's not like I ever said there had to be some set, small number. But I also don't think you can be outside the top 10 or near 15 at any position and be considered elite.

As for Brady, this isn't to downplay anything he's ever done, but one thing I always noticed about Brady, it always seemed like the guys he was throwing the ball to more often were just so wide open compared to the other elite QBs over the years. No clue what it means, if anything, or if it's even accurate, it's just something I noticed over the last 10 ish years.

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