Auburn/Oregon game thread

[Weasel]

I never ever bought into the concept of flow or momentum. Anybody else have any thoughts on that?

I definitely buy into it, not so much from a morale standpoint but more from a schematics view. For instance, a playcaller may get a read on a defense, then set up plays and be 'a step ahead' of the defensive playcaller so to speak, which can build onto itself.

[BFiVL]

I never ever bought into the concept of flow or momentum. Anybody else have any thoughts on that?

I definitely buy into it, not so much from a morale standpoint but more from a schematics view. For instance, a playcaller may get a read on a defense, then set up plays and be 'a step ahead' of the defensive playcaller so to speak, which can build onto itself.

Plus the psyche of a player after a good or bad play, how the individual or team can build on that. Its there.

[DRiccio21]

momentum is definitely there. and you can feel it on the field.

our provincial champ game we came out and hit em in the mouth early. INT, TD, force fumble, TD, another INT, FG.

we rolled most of the game but as they started getting plays you could feel your confidence go down a little bit.

that was until you hit another big play, and it would swing right back.


nothing worse than when the other team has the Mo though, nothing you do works properly, in fact it just seems to make it worse. its a bad feeling.

in my opinion you just explained why its not real. its all mental. the mental aspect of the game is very real... but every play is independent of each other.

[trendon]

That's in-game momentum. I am talking about layoffs and shit. I don't buy into that.

[Weasel]

in my opinion you just explained why its not real. its all mental. the mental aspect of the game is very real... but every play is independent of each other.

Isnt that kind of an oxymoron? How can you have two independent plays when the mental aspect carries over?

Youre saying that play X is going to happen one way, regardless of the how the previous play/quarter/half unfolded?

[Weasel]

That's in-game momentum. I am talking about layoffs and shit. I don't buy into that.

I tend to agree, the whole layoff gets a team "rusty" thing was always just cliche to me

[LetsGoPeay]

That's in-game momentum. I am talking about layoffs and shit. I don't buy into that.

I tend to agree, the whole layoff gets a team "rusty" thing was always just cliche to me

I don't think a team gets rusty physically or mentally but I do think they tend to forget what competition against someone other than themselves is like. You can have full contact practices and scrimmages all you want, but it's just not the same as playing against someone else. A team that just had a 30 day break between games is going to be bound to have a little bit of a shock to the system in that type of scenario.

[DRiccio21]

in my opinion you just explained why its not real. its all mental. the mental aspect of the game is very real... but every play is independent of each other.

Isnt that kind of an oxymoron? How can you have two independent plays when the mental aspect carries over?

Youre saying that play X is going to happen one way, regardless of the how the previous play/quarter/half unfolded?

because not everyone is effected mentally the same way.

certain people have the ability to disregard the outcome of the previous play while others dwell on it and it effects the outcome of the next play.

there is nothing about getting 8 yards on the previous 4 plays that helps you any more or any less on the upcoming play.

my opinion is that if you had 11 players who were all 'mentally tough' (i cringe just typing that) then each play would be independent of itself. however if you had 11 players who were 'mentally weak' then 1 play may carry over to the next.

[cdub21]

in my opinion you just explained why its not real. its all mental. the mental aspect of the game is very real... but every play is independent of each other.

Isnt that kind of an oxymoron? How can you have two independent plays when the mental aspect carries over?

Youre saying that play X is going to happen one way, regardless of the how the previous play/quarter/half unfolded?

because not everyone is effected mentally the same way.

certain people have the ability to disregard the outcome of the previous play while others dwell on it and it effects the outcome of the next play.

there is nothing about getting 8 yards on the previous 4 plays that helps you any more or any less on the upcoming play.

my opinion is that if you had 11 players who were all 'mentally tough' (i cringe just typing that) then each play would be independent of itself. however if you had 11 players who were 'mentally weak' then 1 play may carry over to the next.

facts dave, facts

[DRiccio21]

facts dave, facts

i dont get it.

[cdub21]

facts dave, facts

i dont get it.

you only post opinions based on facts

[Weasel]

certain people have the ability to disregard the outcome of the previous play while others dwell on it and it effects the outcome of the next play.

there is nothing about getting 8 yards on the previous 4 plays that helps you any more or any less on the upcoming play.

my opinion is that if you had 11 players who were all 'mentally tough' (i cringe just typing that) then each play would be independent of itself. however if you had 11 players who were 'mentally weak' then 1 play may carry over to the next.

I see exactly where youre coming from, I just disagree. I dont think anyone can completely eliminate the emotions involved throughout a game/quarter/series. You talk in other threads how hard (if not impossible) it is for people to remove bias and emotion, yet here youre saying the 'mentally tough' can do it. Even if that were the case, that those who are mentally tough can play each play with a fresh mental state, its hard to imagine everyone on the field at the time having the same capacity, not to mention the coaches calling the plays.

[DRiccio21]

facts dave, facts

i dont get it.

you only post opinions based on facts

ahhh, this is true.

thats kind of why i wrote 'in my opinion' cause this isn't really a topic where we can be objective. theres no way of objectifying how someone is thinking before or after a play.

because there are no facts and i could be wrong i wont be calling anyone an idiot on this topic.

[ajalves]

in my opinion you just explained why its not real. its all mental. the mental aspect of the game is very real... but every play is independent of each other.

Isnt that kind of an oxymoron? How can you have two independent plays when the mental aspect carries over?

Youre saying that play X is going to happen one way, regardless of the how the previous play/quarter/half unfolded?

because not everyone is effected mentally the same way.

certain people have the ability to disregard the outcome of the previous play while others dwell on it and it effects the outcome of the next play.

there is nothing about getting 8 yards on the previous 4 plays that helps you any more or any less on the upcoming play.

my opinion is that if you had 11 players who were all 'mentally tough' (i cringe just typing that) then each play would be independent of itself. however if you had 11 players who were 'mentally weak' then 1 play may carry over to the next.

this would also imply that great players dont use "runs" or momentum in their favor

[cdub21]

facts dave, facts

i dont get it.

you only post opinions based on facts

ahhh, this is true.

thats kind of why i wrote 'in my opinion' cause this isn't really a topic where we can be objective. theres no way of objectifying how someone is thinking before or after a play.

because there are no facts and i could be wrong i wont be calling anyone an idiot on this topic.

lol fair enough

[DRiccio21]

certain people have the ability to disregard the outcome of the previous play while others dwell on it and it effects the outcome of the next play.

there is nothing about getting 8 yards on the previous 4 plays that helps you any more or any less on the upcoming play.

my opinion is that if you had 11 players who were all 'mentally tough' (i cringe just typing that) then each play would be independent of itself. however if you had 11 players who were 'mentally weak' then 1 play may carry over to the next.

I see exactly where youre coming from, I just disagree. I dont think anyone can completely eliminate the emotions involved throughout a game/quarter/series. You talk in other threads how hard (if not impossible) it is for people to remove bias and emotion, yet here youre saying the 'mentally tough' can do it. Even if that were the case, that those who are mentally tough can play each play with a fresh mental state, its hard to imagine everyone on the field at the time having the same capacity, not to mention the coaches calling the plays.

i dont think anyone can 'completely' eliminate emotions but i think certain people can certainly do it more then others. a rookie who stinks who just got burnt for a 20 yard pass would PROBABLY be more effected mentally then a 10 year all pro.

if that is in fact true (that some people can be effected less) then the point is proven that its the mental state causing the issues on the next play and not actual 'momentum'

i just dont believe that 1 play or a series of plays causes the next play to be any more likely to be successful or less successful SIMPLY based off the fact the previous plays were successful.

[Weasel]

if that is in fact true (that some people can be effected less) then the point is proven that its the mental state causing the issues on the next play and not actual 'momentum'

Which was my original point, plays are absolutely dependent on one another. That's all I was getting at, that plays are not independant

[Weasel]

A team that just had a 30 day break between games is going to be bound to have a little bit of a shock to the system in that type of scenario.

Thats the one scenario that I agree with, the layoff before bowl games. But when its a playoff system and a team gets five or six days before the next series I call bullshit

[ajalves]

this is why they have spring training

[DRiccio21]

if that is in fact true (that some people can be effected less) then the point is proven that its the mental state causing the issues on the next play and not actual 'momentum'

Which was my original point, plays are absolutely dependent on one another. That's all I was getting at, that plays are not independant

if momentum is real then it should be something that works the same way against person A as it does against person B, no?

if not then there is some other reason the success or lack of is happening.