NFL Thread

[trendon]

Nearly every single one of you people in this league are morons. It is frightening.

[shel311]

[shel311]

I said third down conversions are a useless, misleading stat.

I never said third down isn't important

So it's important, but useless?

Makes sense.

[Weasel]

Nearly every single one of you people in this league are morons. It is frightening.

Phew, there is a chance I escaped!

[nick]

5 of the top 10 teams in 3rd down % are not in the playoffs and the 11th is the 2nd overall pick (Washington).. so... ya.... about that important stat

[nick]

Seattle, best in the league, 17th in 3rd downs. how did they do it?? 3rd downs are important!

[shel311]

Seattle, best in the league, 17th in 3rd downs. how did they do it?? 3rd downs are important!

They didn't do it, so there's that. Even if they did, you ever thought that maybe the lower 3rd down conversion % is why they're only 8th in points per game despite being "1st" in drive score %, meaning more field goals because of the lower 3rd down %? Nah, that could never happen.

Also, what are your thoughts on my post about the Broncos/Manning? Just a big, crazy coincidence right?

[shel311]

5 of the top 10 teams in 3rd down % are not in the playoffs and the 11th is the 2nd overall pick (Washington).. so... ya.... about that important stat

6 of the top 16 in scoring drive % didn't make the playoffs.

7 of the top 16 in 3rd down % didn't make the playoffs.

Oh the horror, ONE more team, OMG!!!!


And using who makes the playoffs is rather stupid considering this just accounts for offense. Nice job ignoring defense, makes your point pretty much irrelevant any way.

[jsence2]

I think when he says "misleading", he's talking about the fact that some teams may have bad 3rd down conversion rates, but may convert more on first or second down. Thus, the stat doesn't show how well they truly move the ball.

[shel311]

I think when he says "misleading", he's talking about the fact that some teams may have bad 3rd down conversion rates, but may convert more on first or second down. Thus, the stat doesn't show how well they truly move the ball.

That's fine. And in case trendon or nick hasn't noticed, I never once argue t 3rd down rates are better.

The issue is saying 3rd down rates are useless, that's laughable. Then to say or insinuate that they are important while also saying they're useless is just a head scratcher.

[nick]

Shel im not here to change your opinion so believe what you want.

[cougnix]

Hey guys, guess what the most important stat is, Wins. Game over

[uf83198]

And "games are won on third down" might be the craziest sentence ever.

You're not looking at it from both sides of the ball. Good teams are successful on 3rd down offensively and defensively. I think 3rd down % and turnovers are two of the most important stats to be concerned with as a coach.

But I will concede that when the 3rd down conversion/stop happens or the yardage to gain is more important. A team might give up several 3rd down conversions on a drive but get a stop on the last one and make the O settle for a FG. Whereas an offense might only have 1 3rd down conversion (lets say a 3rd and short) on a drive, and that lets them continue the drive to a TD. So in these instances, those stats could be misleading.

But tight games usually come down to a handful of plays, and a lot of the time those are 3rd downs, so ya, Games are won and lost on 3rd down.

[nick]

Washington had the 11th best 3rd down % on O and the 4th best on D and finished with the 2nd overall pick.

[uf83198]

Cant judge a team on any one stat, they were also minus 8 in turnovers for the season. Not saying 3rd down % is the end all/be all stat, but to say it is useless and misleading is a stretch.

A useless, misleading stat is saying I went 1 for 25 at the bar last night.

[shel311]

Shel im not here to change your opinion so believe what you want.

Thanks, that means a lot to me.

[LetsGoPeay]

I hereby move to officially change the word "semantics" to "shelmantics" in honor of the person who has argued them more than any other human in history not named Bill Clinton.

Seconds?

[Cnasty]

Better trademark that one!

[shel311]

I hereby move to officially change the word "semantics" to "shelmantics" in honor of the person who has argued them more than any other human in history not named Bill Clinton.

Seconds?

Not sure you're applying semantics correctly here.

Saying something is useless then also insinuating it's important is different than a semantics argument, no? Like, basically the opposite.

If you said you don't like the Pacers, then later said the Pacers are your favorite team, I don't think that's semantics in play

[Cnasty]

It's funny Shel, they are actually reviewing it which is silly.

They should go back and review every pass Brees threw then or Manning how many times he did this on the season with an incorrect call.

When I saw it on the Saints message boards, I laughed it off at first. Then they mentioned how ESPN had it on their main headlines and actually took it down, then I was pretty shocked to see they may actually take it away.

If Manning had played the entire game, that may be 1 thing. But it's kinda silly considering he sat out the entire 2nd half or some shit.

After further review, play stands as called.