NDL Forum

again, you need money to win for the most part

qazhby wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 4:37 pm

Ry wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 4:23 pm We don’t seem to have the over intentional tanking owners that we used to

Pete is shivering in his boots right now

Nah, don't really give a crap what anyone thinks.

only joking Pete

The struggles of life in the bEAST

PO is in Florida, dont these free agents know we dont have state income tax

nick wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 4:45 pm

ajalves wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 4:44 pm like why isn't everyone market size the same at the very least

Cause you earn that by being good?

I used to think this, but honestly I can't find any data that actually supports it.

Most people on the ootp forums thinks its random.

I don't really have any ideas of how to deal with it though. I'm actually kinda in the boat that it should be reset every X amount of years.

Market size is earned and loyalty is earned. It’d be stupid to make it the same for all.

Ry wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 5:08 pm Market size is earned and loyalty is earned. It’d be stupid to make it the same for all.

This just isn't true about market size though.

In real life the Knicks are terrible, but they still have a massive market size, why? They play in New York, nothing was earned by that lol.

Another example would be the Tampa Bay Rays, who have been a consistently good team for a while now despite being a super low budget team and their market size hasn't increased by being good. By your logic they would have "earned" a bigger market size while in reality they are still a low market team due to being in Tampa Bay who couldn't care less about baseball.

Anecdotal, but some OOTP examples in this thread link

We're also playing a simulation. The game doesn't understand real life geographic markets. Years and years of winning plus retaining your own star players for many years seems to be the formula to build size and loyalty.

ajalves wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 4:16 pm My issue is when you 'get screwed' in the lottery, when you werent tanking, you just stunk.....how exactly are you supposed to reverse that? When you need money to win games and you need to win games to make money?

Don't get me wrong, getting a #1 pick is nice and better than any other pick, but there's a lot that goes into winning. Going from the #1 pick to the #6 pick in 1 season won't be the ultimate difference in success or no success. Sure, it could be the difference in a title and a ALCS visit if that #1 pick is elite, but if you never build a winner it's not because you dropped from 1 to 6, it's because you sucked at a lot of other stuff. Not saying Pete sucks but you get the poi...nah I'm saying Pete sucks!

qazhby wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 5:15 pm

Ry wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 5:08 pm Market size is earned and loyalty is earned. It’d be stupid to make it the same for all.

This just isn't true about market size though.

Just looking at Above Average Market Size in our league. San Antonio has been to 7 playoffs since 2043 are in a Big Market, the Beef have been to the playoffs 13 times in that same span. Both teams have 1 WS title overall and have 4 playoff appearances in the last 10 years. The Beef have an Average Market. how does a team with better play recently be two rungs lower on the Market Size if it's tied to winning?

San Francisco has a Big Market and they have only been to the playoffs 3 times in the last 20 seasons.

So I don'lt think it's tied to winning, at least when it comes to recently.

Ry wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 5:20 pm We're also playing a simulation. The game doesn't understand real life geographic markets. Years and years of winning plus retaining your own star players for many years seems to be the formula to build size and loyalty.

+1

There's definitely a formula in the game that determines Market Size & Fan Loyalty that includes winning. You can just look around the league to make that determination. There are teams that have been in the league a lot longer than my franchise that doesn't have a "BIG" market. I believe that your budget is a factor in there as well.

Its so easy to make money in this game, but you really have to pay attention to detail. You should always be adjusting your ticket prices according to your attendance and Fan Interest is very important when it comes to selling tickets.

Market size will keep AJ from competing for a long time. He won't get the revenue to better help his team.

I guarantee San Francisco Steelers is a mistake, it should have been reset once that franchise moved or changed owners.

San Francisco at one point used to be one of the Chicago franchises belonging to ....I forget his name. He won many many titles, had star players all the time- thus the reason for the market size they have. That franchise has a history of winning though it has been a LOOOONG time since they have been successful. I also believe SA at one point was a successful franchise but I forget who it is.
To me, it makes common sense. Win for decades, keep your star players = grow your market and loyalty. I've seen it firsthand with my franchise. Same with Nick, Billy and a few others who constantly win and keep their stars the best they can.

I'm pretty sure it was the ChicagoLOLCats. But you're also talking 60 years ago. And if that was the case then AJ should be much higher because he won a bunch back then also

GeorgesGoons wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 5:56 pm I'm pretty sure it was the ChicagoLOLCats. But you're also talking 60 years ago. And if that was the case then AJ should be much higher because he won a bunch back then also

AJs port orange is not the same port orange that he used to have.

1) I like the lottery (though I'm biased as I haven't experienced it yet). From a commish perspective though. It does a few things:
A) It does stop the ultra tankers. Granted we don't have any of those anymore. However, maybe we would if we didn't have the lottery. Hard to say but I like the hard stopping of tanking which leads to...
B) Having one team pick near the top or the actual top in more than 2 or 3 drafts in a row can cause real issues. Savvy owners can have elite teams for a really long time if done properly. That shit is boring. No offense to Corey at all (a compliment tbh) but the Boston superteam days were boring as fuck to me. This helps stems that as the variance in draft (as explicitly demonstrated by this year's draft) keeps that from happening.
C) Gives bad teams something fun to look forward to. Maybe not fun when you drop spots, but fun for other teams to jump spots etc. It spices things up which I'm a huge fan of.

2) Market Size IS something that can grow in this game. I have no clue what causes it but I don't think it is correlated to a team's success. I could be wrong though. Part of the game unfortunately will always be some teams have bigger market sizes (just like IRL). This is something that can be brought up Winter Meetings (equalizing Market Size for all) but I'm not going to comment on which way I lean as I don't want to bias anyone.

3) Fan Loyalty is 100% tied to your team's success. Consistent winning and not trading away stars every time is key as, Ry said.

4) Money available is something that takes time to grow. I know PO is the only team with under a 100M budget, I believe. Best advice I can give is to always ALWAYS maximize your stadium seating. Set prices to have a full house or as close as you can all the time. Also, free agency is a trap IMO but I won't go balls deep into that.

5) To be clear, owners have zero influence on your budget. You get exactly what you made in revenue (in the regular season) for the following year. If your owner gives or takes money from you that is corrected in the rollover via cash adjustments on my end (and to my knowledge has been this way forever, at least as long as I've been around ~40 seasons).

6) Don't ever feel bad for discussing this shit on here. I don't have direct communication with a lot of you (and that's fine) but chances are pretty damn good the ideas/criticisms you have are shared by at least (if not a lot more) GMs. I want to strive to have everyone enjoy the league for their own reasons and will always try my best to make that possible. It's inevitable that some people won't like certain aspects of the league and I'm 100% ok with people bringing up why and us having a respectful debate or sharing our reasons etc.

7) If you have questions about the way anything works or even want some advice on shit (unless you are Omaha then f off) I am happy to help. Slack is probably easier to communicate on though.

The cons to money is im abojt to lose 280million to Villy

The pros is I’ve released bad contracts and it doesn’t really effect my budget

[youtube]mU-YWAORbqw[/youtube]

SmittyRocks7 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 16, 2021 5:48 pm I guarantee San Francisco Steelers is a mistake, it should have been reset once that franchise moved or changed owners.

He stayed in San Francisco - just changed the team name to Steelers from Seals. To my knowledge, new owners don't have their market size, fan loyalty, and fan interest changed. I could be wrong though. I'm sure Billy will correct me.

If a team moves or relocates (after 2 seasons in the case of new owners) then those things are adjusted.