NDL Forum

Cnasty wrote:Wife says to me tonight, “some pornstar killed her self after being cyber bullied. Her name was August Ames, ever heard of her?”

shel311 wrote:We need a do over on this whole gender thing that has popped up recently, a do over would help.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/12/06/wa ... cates.html

This is just stupid! This is parents dictating what gender their kid is on paper and thru their philosophy.

My sister in law is gay and married and we discuss these things all the time, which is hard to do because she is very sensitive about LGBT issues (rightfully so). But this is where I do not budge, you are a man or a woman. You cannot change chromosomes just because you don't want to stand up and piss anymore. You'll always be a man, you may identify as a woman but you are a man. If you break the law and you identify as the other sex they are still sending you to prison that suits your birth gender. Not sure how that works for trans people though.

My son told me last year there were something like 40+ different identities that people can identify as. We, as parents, are failing our youth and our future once we become retirement age. The generation we are raising are full of pussies that would rather go cry about someone treating them bad rather than punching that mofo in the mouth and to stop the bullying. We have come to where it's more okay to just walk away rather than defending ourselves. Maybe that is because of how we grew up and we don't want our kids to grow up that same way so we shelter them.

/rant

but seriously, I am nervous about the kids that have been born after 9/11. A bunch of entitled little shitheads

okay, seriously /rant

GeorgesGoons wrote:rather than punching that mofo in the mouth and to stop the bullying

George is gonna punch me in the mouth if he ever sees me.

shel311 wrote:

GeorgesGoons wrote:rather than punching that mofo in the mouth and to stop the bullying

George is gonna punch me in the mouth if he ever sees me.

Not at all. That shit hurts now as an adult! Only fight if I have zero other options. But what you do, I don't see as bullying. You just try to get a reaction from people.

GeorgesGoons wrote:

shel311 wrote:

GeorgesGoons wrote:rather than punching that mofo in the mouth and to stop the bullying

George is gonna punch me in the mouth if he ever sees me.

Not at all. That shit hurts now as an adult! Only fight if I have zero other options. But what you do, I don't see as bullying. You just try to get a reaction from people.

The only time I would have zero problems fighting is if anyone disrespected my wife. Would not hesitate, wouldn't say a word of trying to get him/her to apologize either. My son on the other hand, he better handle that shit himself, unless it was an adult and then I'd have no problem there either

GeorgesGoons wrote:

GeorgesGoons wrote:

shel311 wrote:

GeorgesGoons wrote:rather than punching that mofo in the mouth and to stop the bullying

George is gonna punch me in the mouth if he ever sees me.

Not at all. That shit hurts now as an adult! Only fight if I have zero other options. But what you do, I don't see as bullying. You just try to get a reaction from people.

The only time I would have zero problems fighting is if anyone disrespected my wife. Would not hesitate, wouldn't say a word of trying to get him/her to apologize either. My son on the other hand, he better handle that shit himself, unless it was an adult and then I'd have no problem there either

Fuck you and your wife. She making you buy phones and shit when you could be hanging with us.

New game mode for Fortnight. 50v50. Be on tonight gaybird.

BFiVL wrote:

GeorgesGoons wrote:

GeorgesGoons wrote:

shel311 wrote:

GeorgesGoons wrote:rather than punching that mofo in the mouth and to stop the bullying

George is gonna punch me in the mouth if he ever sees me.

Not at all. That shit hurts now as an adult! Only fight if I have zero other options. But what you do, I don't see as bullying. You just try to get a reaction from people.

The only time I would have zero problems fighting is if anyone disrespected my wife. Would not hesitate, wouldn't say a word of trying to get him/her to apologize either. My son on the other hand, he better handle that shit himself, unless it was an adult and then I'd have no problem there either

Fuck you and your wife. She making you buy phones and shit when you could be hanging with us.

New game mode for Fortnight. 50v50. Be on tonight gaybird.

Played with Jake and Corey. Was fun

http://www.tmz.com/2017/12/07/mesa-poli ... el-shaver/

This cop was just found not guilty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Daniel_Shaver

Unbelievable man.

Dude had a .29 BAC, comes out of a room with guns pointed at him...definitely deserves to lose his life for not following instructions. I'm not sure I could follow those instructions if someone just told me to randomly do it, they were confusing as hell. Cross your legs and crawl forward with your hands above your head.

What's with the crawl to us orders? Wasn't he subdued when his face was down and hands on his head, considering there's 4-5 cops with guns about 5-10 feet away from him?


The shooting cop also had "you're fucked" inscribed on his AR-15...Protect and serve!!!!

shel311 wrote: The shooting cop also had "you're fucked" inscribed on his AR-15...Protect and serve!!!!

That doesn't bother me at all. Defense was trying to get it added as evidence, you are fucked if that comes open.

But like you said, he was subdued when his hands were on his head and feet crossed. The extra order baffles me to I realize why they were called. I understand it because they don't know for sure if someone is in the room still. They were called because someone was waving a gun from the hotel room. I watched the video, I would have a hard time convicting the cop. His hand went down to his right hip/lower back and these decisions are made in fractions of a second.

It's easy for us (not just NDL) to arm chair quarterback and dissect their actions. You can't risk your life just to make sure he doesn't have a gun. Sucks for the family that it ended this way.

GeorgesGoons wrote:That doesn't bother me at all. Defense was trying to get it added as evidence, you are fucked if that comes open.

I'm certainly no legal expert but it would seem 100% fair if that were added as evidence(it wasn't allowed) because it would establish the mindset of the shooting cop here. His mindset wasn't to protect or serve, his mindset was to shoot anyone who did not comply with orders. His inscription insinuated that, and his actions proved it, so it seems fair to have it as evidence IMO.

GeorgesGoons wrote:His hand went down to his right hip/lower back and these decisions are made in fractions of a second.

It's easy for us (not just NDL) to arm chair quarterback and dissect their actions. You can't risk your life just to make sure he doesn't have a gun.

Right, but as you and I said, they could have subdued him before but didn't. And again, the instructions they gave him were confusing and something I don't even think a sober person with no gun pointed at him could follow correctly, certainly not every time. It was confusing as fuck, that's on the cop that was barking out the orders.

shel311 wrote:

GeorgesGoons wrote:That doesn't bother me at all. Defense was trying to get it added as evidence, you are fucked if that comes open.

I'm certainly no legal expert but it would seem 100% fair if that were added as evidence(it wasn't allowed) because it would establish the mindset of the shooting cop here. His mindset wasn't to protect or serve, his mindset was to shoot anyone who did not comply with orders. His inscription insinuated that, and his actions proved it, so it seems fair to have it as evidence IMO.

GeorgesGoons wrote:His hand went down to his right hip/lower back and these decisions are made in fractions of a second.

It's easy for us (not just NDL) to arm chair quarterback and dissect their actions. You can't risk your life just to make sure he doesn't have a gun.

Right, but as you and I said, they could have subdued him before but didn't. And again, the instructions they gave him were confusing and something I don't even think a sober person with no gun pointed at him could follow correctly, certainly not every time. It was confusing as fuck, that's on the cop that was barking out the orders.

You misunderstood me i think. They could have subdued him prior, but they still didn't know if there was someone in the room with a scoped rifle (what they were called to the hotel for). They can't put themselves in that danger.

The whole dust cover thing. I just don't think you understand dark humor. This kind of thing pretty common in the military, I'm sure its the same in law enforcement.

https://tactical-expressions.com/ar-15- ... ucked.html

But also, take it with a grain of salt that I am a very by the book and there isn't much room for grey area when it comes to rules/laws. If I have a gun pointed at me, you better believe that if they want me to hopscotch over to them I will do my damnest to figure out how to hopscotch. I am not like most young people who think cops are bad and that they should be immediately found guilty in the eye of the citizens prior to getting all the facts. They have an extremely difficult job where they need to make decisions in fractions of a second that can either keep someone alive, themselves alive or take a life to subdue what is seen as a threat.

GeorgesGoons wrote:If I have a gun pointed at me, you better believe that if they want me to hopscotch over to them I will do my damnest to figure out how to hopscotch.

Couple things on that.

1. I'm sure you are or would be more "comfortable" for lack of a better term with a gun pointed at you than most. Cops should also understand that not everyone is equipped to calmly handle that situation, these cops seemed to clearly not understand that.

2. The dude was drunk as fuck and basically ambushed/totally unexpected.

3. And probably most importantly, the instructions given to him are instructions that arguably couldn't even be followed, especially for a drunk dude in that situation, it just couldn't be done. Cross your legs, hands above your head, and crawl. Nah, that can't be done. And if you don't, you get shot. And if you fall, you can't instinctively use your hands to break your fall, or you get shot. It's total BS.


That should have ended much differently. Either those cops have shit for training or they completely botched how they handled it, there's no chance it should have ended the way it did.

shel311 wrote:

GeorgesGoons wrote:If I have a gun pointed at me, you better believe that if they want me to hopscotch over to them I will do my damnest to figure out how to hopscotch.

Couple things on that.

1. I'm sure you are or would be more "comfortable" for lack of a better term with a gun pointed at you than most. Cops should also understand that not everyone is equipped to calmly handle that situation, these cops seemed to clearly not understand that.

2. The dude was drunk as fuck and basically ambushed/totally unexpected.

3. And probably most importantly, the instructions given to him are instructions that arguably couldn't even be followed, especially for a drunk dude in that situation, it just couldn't be done. Cross your legs, hands above your head, and crawl. Nah, that can't be done. And if you don't, you get shot. And if you fall, you can't instinctively use your hands to break your fall, or you get shot. It's total BS.


That should have ended much differently. Either those cops have shit for training or they completely botched how they handled it, there's no chance it should have ended the way it did.

If you fall you don't get shot. If you reach to your waist, yea you get shot. I don't have a problem with that.

Agree, that it shouldn't have ended that way. But his actions, by reaching to his waist right after being told if he did that again he would get shot, are why the ending happened the way it did. You are not thinking that the cops are thinking that there might be someone in the room with a rifle, no other reason to get them to crawl towards them away from the door. Like I said, I feel sorry for his family. But I don't think a cop should be convicted here when orders weren't complied and he made a split second decision when the guys hand went down to his waist.

I wouldn't say I am comfortable. Have had a gun on me once in my life. A cop had a gun to the back of my head, scary as shit! And you better believe I listened to each word he said.

Poor training/a trigger happy cop is why it ended poorly, man.

This is probably the 2nd most egregious one of these I've seen, it was botched so badly by these cops.

If we can't subdue THAT guy in THAT situation without killing him with 4-5 cops with AR-15s, we have a really fucked up situation on our hands in regards to cops and their training.


You're also just saying you would do whatever the cops said but not really addressing that they were saying conflicting things. Nevermind adding in being shitfaced drunk to the equation.

shel311 wrote:Poor training/a trigger happy cop is why it ended poorly, man.

This is probably the 2nd most egregious one of these I've seen, it was botched so badly by these cops.

If we can't subdue THAT guy in THAT situation without killing him with 4-5 cops with AR-15s, we have a really fucked up situation on our hands in regards to cops and their training.


You're also just saying you would do whatever the cops said but not really addressing that they were saying conflicting things. Nevermind adding in being shitfaced drunk to the equation.

Cops don't get paid all that much....don't even need a degree to be one (not that a degree makes you 'smarter' per say)

you get what you pay for

and you aren't taking into account that there might be a guy in the room with a rifle.


And I agree with AJ, you do get what you "pay for." It's sad to say that but it is reality.

GeorgesGoons wrote:and you aren't taking into account that there might be a guy in the room with a rifle.

That's a fair point on a couple of points I said, but it doesn't change my overriding point. Put a guy in the room with a rifle or not, that shot was horrible and unwarranted.

I get it, it's obviously a tough situation, life and death shit for these cops. And AJ is also correct, you get what you pay for. But if you can't do it and people die as a result, then we have a pretty big problem on our hands that's killing innocent people.